With the server changes, it looks like I may have to learn to love 2Fort. My usual Heavy/human sentry ploy is fine for a game in rotation but was astonishingy boring for an hour and a half last night

Time to try a new class. I'm just not fast or accurate enough to attack in the narrow confines of 2Fort. I was thinking about trying a "defensive" Engi. I've observed sentry placement but I'm not sure about teleporters.

What are the good/accepted places for teleporter entrances? I've noticed that exits aren't always placed in the Intell Room. Is there a reason for that? Where else should they go? Answers to these questions and any other advice would be gratefully received

Cheers

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Peanut - "... or is your beard broken again ...?"

in the enemies intel room is a good place if you can get them there!

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As an engineer you have two primary purposes, of which the second is poorly executed by n00bs, however if done well, is the most important class there is:

#1. Defend
Great placement and if in a high traffic area, DO NOT budge from it, spies are too strong in TF2 to go leaving it.

Also you dispenser is a life line for your team, not just your personal honey pot, bear that in mind

#2 Attack
So you have your sentry up and its covering your valuable asset(s) [such as the intelligence, a cap or a route to either].

Get into your enemies base and slap up a teleporter exit, doesn't even have to right on their spawn or right in the action, but close. Fatties could take up to 15 times longer to get to a point than a scout, so having a tele up is vital to getting your team the the action as fast as possible (for obvious reasons), with easy access from your team mates spawning.

So in 2fort, slip a tele outside the front doors or while you have your SG in the water, a tele in a corner tucked out of obvious sight.

As an engineer, besides being gifted to create such a wonderful n00b-killing device, you are graced with a Shotgun; Use it, you'll be surprised by the number of free 'kill Assist', even if you do not take them down.

Don't even bother with the pistol, it fast reloads, but you need 3 clips to do any damage.

If you're in close quarters combat, get that wrench out, they kit hit something like 40-50% of the time, one hit and they're severally injured, if not dead.

#3 Work Together
Yep there is a 3rd one, team work

Fact: Two engineers build stuff faster than one alone, team up with another one and work together, when his SG is taking a battering, spanner it and when I'm playing, if their SG is more strategic than mine, I will continue to repair even at the expense of my own buildings and life.

Prime example, if you have two engineers working togeter on Badwater, you can have two level 3 sentries and teles up way BEFORE the timer goes, where as working on your own you'll be lucky to get a level 2 and a dispenser.

My 2p to being an Engineer.

Matt

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Not really played as engy that much so don't have a lot to add.

However, the one tactic I've found really useful once you've got you level 3 sentry up is to act as bait. The likes of soldiers, pyros and heavies find it hard to resist the easy pickings of an engineer running around with a pistol.

Loiter just round the corner from your sentry until you get spotted, run back round and watch the enemy follow you straight down the jaws of your sentry.

The best thing is, some people never learn and will do it over and over again in the heat of the battle. Works particularly well on the likes of 2Fort with it's maze of tunnels

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I use this tactic too! A word of warning, just ensure that you don't get in-between your sentry and the enemy as you can be cut down by 'friendly fire' from your own sentry! Quite humiliating, but you will (should!) only do it the once

1 seperate tactic i like to add, although it would be incredibly hard to do in a 32 man fast spawn. 

[ Edited Wed Sep 10 08, 02:59PM ]

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Watch my videos

I want to try that Tele, but despite what he says about luck, I suspect their's some skill toit and I'll die horribly.

Wouldn't mind having him on my team though.

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Have another link here, semi on topic.

Just tips and tricks for all classes.

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Watch my videos

Love that vid

thats a great vid, hope i can put some of those tips to work!

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Be careful with heavy baiting as an engineer. If the loud beeping your sentry emits doesn't tip them off that there's a stack of engi widgets around the corner, a nervous engineer looking around corners in one spot surely will, and if you're running a long way away to distract people, you'd best like being sapped.
2fort tele placement comes in a few popular flavours, as far as I've seen:

Rat's nest: dumping a tele exit, dispenser and sentry in the little open area with the medpak in the enemy sewers. They're not likely to find it for a while, but when they do, a demo/medic combo will wipe you out, no trouble.
Rat's nest+: as above, but dump the exit (and only the exit) in the corner right below the stairs in their sewers. There's a small chance that they won't discover it for the entire round (though the sparklies will be a dead giveaway), but once they do find it, don't try this position for a good half hour.
Cheeky monkey: in which you convince your team to escort you (or play ninja engi) into their intel room then set up your widgets. If you can get to level 3, you'll probably get at least 1 cap. If you can get two engis to level 3, you've normally won the match.

There's a few others. Particularly taking advantage of the "people never look backwards" thing and dumping them in the spy recovery spots on the far left or right or the opposition's outdoor area. Or something exotic, stick them underwater.

It's sometimes worth sticking your tele entrance under a hay bale, too. That way, if it's online it's nice and easy to see, if it's offline, the other team can't see it very easily in the thick of a fight.

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"I am asking you a serious question about the location and current status of your pants."
Tycho Brahe

Alas, if I was fast and cunning enough to do this, I'd be a Scout or a Spy

Worth every penny. Good advice. I hadn't thought of exits in the enemy base. I didn't think they'd last long enough to be useful. Reading this and other posts, it seems that they are.

Good ploy . I'd noticed something similar myself. If my Heavy is covering the intell and an Engi has set up a sentry in the opposite corner, the opposition go straight for the Heavy. So the sentry comes as a bit of a shock

Lots of good stuff, here, Tele. I think it will be a while before I'm emulating the chap in your first vid, though. Very impressive.

That's just the kind of stuff I need to know. Many thanks.

You've given me lots to think about, try and work on. Thanks, all.

A bit OT but it does puzzle me. Even on a full server, teams often leave the Intell Room "empty". It seems to me that if the opposition can't take the intell, they can't win a point. Even if an Engi sets up a sentry and then leaves it to place teleporters or whatever, it 's easily defeated by a Demoman or Spy. Taking Moggie's #3 point, two Engi's could set up a couple of sentries in the Intell Room in no time. If one looked after those while the other placed their teleporters, it would be a formidable defence. I'm sure it must have been tried and failed. I'd be interested to know why.

Cheers

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Peanut - "... or is your beard broken again ...?"

Very few people have the patience to sit in the intel room for a whole round just reloading sentries. Otherwise, that probably would work Greybeard. Also, if one engie stays behind, that's one less teleport to the front line. And even if the enemy team can't get a point, it's little help if you can't either.

I've found one good place for a sentry that Biospark didn't mention. Like the intel, you need to be escorted, but not as far. Just under the hole in the ceiling inside the front doors, though not in such a way that they can shoot straight down at it. It cuts off pretty much the entire first floor, so they have to waste time taking down your sentry (which usually means leaving their intel) or use the battlements and get sniped

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Doesn't matter how many Sentries you stick up in the Intel room, all it takes is an úbered Demoman to destroy any defence. Pyro will work aswell as long as the push isn't too much.

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REDRUM
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Agreed on the "patience" front. I'm strange like that However, you would only need one "human" presence at a time. The other Engi can go and place their exit, then return and swap. Or is it expected that Engi's stick around and maintain their exits? And thanks for the other recommendation for an exit placement.

Which prompts another thought. Is it more important to place entries near spawn and exits in enemy territory to get the team near the action rather than giving your team a fast route back with an exit in the Intell Room and an entry in enemy territory?

There's a lot to this Engineer thing, isn't there

Cheers

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Peanut - "... or is your beard broken again ...?"

No point having an entrance in enemy territory, main reason being that you can't use a teleporter while carrying the intel.

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REDRUM
Music Video made by me and my brothers [yt=150,150]gTinjrxt7No[/yt]

Sentry placement's a horse of a different colour. The thing with a tele exit is if they find it, it's getting smashed, so the only way you can defend it is to put up a lot of nasty, big, LOUD engie gadgets around it.
Problematic.
I just tend to find that if you're getting your team nice and close, but at the same time making it hard for the other guys to know where the new spawn point is, you're doing your job.

Sentries are iffy. You can put them in the stock locations, but people expect that, so mixing things up can be fun. Far as I know, the 3 main spots are just outside the main spawn (facing the courtyard, but indoor enough that a pyro on the floor below can't light you up but you can still get shots off), in the sewers or in your intel.
With sentries, when you enter a base, after the fork converges into one route there's two ways to turn. Putting a sentry either behind the wall on your right or just on the left works nicely, the right more than the left (it's a little open to rogue demos in the sewer).
I'm fond of putting one at the top of the slope, too. Confuses people to no end, when they're expecting one just outside your spawn.

If you're playing offensive engie, anywhere that you can get the thing to stick, though.

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"I am asking you a serious question about the location and current status of your pants."
Tycho Brahe

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|UKMD| MoggieX Notes: If u see a cheater, record them! If u see an Admin being pratt report them to me If u see a n00b, thats me! Help keep the server running with 'Rent a Slot':
	Rent A Server Slot: £10.00 - R.A.S.S 1 £15.00 - R.A.S.S 1.5 £20.00 - R.A.S.S 2 £25.00 - R.A.S.S 2.5 £30.00 - R.A.S.S 3 £35.00 - R.A.S.S 3.5 £40.00 - R.A.S.S 4 £50.00 - R.A.S.S 5 £60.00 - R.A.S.S 6 £75.00 - R.A.S.S 7 £100.00 - R.A.S.S 8 R.A.S.S = Rent A Sever Slot

As an indication of how little (a) 2Fort I've played and (b) attacking I've done on CTF maps, I didn't realise this

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Peanut - "... or is your beard broken again ...?"

Better add in that you can't úber someone with the Intel. Also, if you're a Medic carrying the Intel you can still activate the úber on someone but it won't work on you

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REDRUM
Music Video made by me and my brothers [yt=150,150]gTinjrxt7No[/yt]